At what point can it be assumed that a person davened correctly?

As we have learned, one who added Morid Hageshem in the summer must go back to the beginning of the brocha. If one mistakenly said Morid Hatal in the winter, he is yotzei and does not need to go back. If he did not say anything, he must go back. If a person is not sure what he said, Shulchon Aruch rules that he must assume that he said the wrong thing for the first thirty days after the change in Shemoneh Esrei. Afterwards, he can assume that he made the correct addition. According to some Achronim, the term “thirty days” that is used by Shulchon Aruch actually refers to ninety tefillos. In that case, one would reach the milestone of being able to trust that he said Morid Hatal/Geshem before thirty days have passed (since on some days there are four tefillos). Conversely, one would need to wait for more than thirty days in order to trust that he said V’sein Tal, since this tefilla is only recited during the week. A person who serves as chazan can add his Chazoras Hashatz to the count.

סי' קי"ד ס"ח ס"ק ל"ז ביאורים ומוספים דרשו 38

Do the first two days of Pesach count as part of the thirty days of not saying V’Sein Tal Umatar?

Other poskim disagree and hold that thirty days is to be taken literally, even if in some cases it may involve more or less than ninety tefillos. In some instances, this view is more stringent than the first opinion (regarding Morid Hageshem/Tal) and other times it is more lenient (regarding V’sein Tal Umatar). Based on the rule that we do not recite extra brochos when we are in doubt, one should always take the more lenient position and try to refrain from repeating Shemoneh Esrei. In a case where one is counting thirty days but he did not daven on one of the days, the poskim disagree on whether that day counts as one of the thirty. According to the opinion which holds that it counts, one may question whether the first two days of Pesach count as the first two days of saying V’sein Brocha. Although V’sein Brocha was not actually said, V’sein Tal U’Matar was omitted. Certainly, if a person failed to daven on the days leading up to Pesach, they cannot be counted towards the thirty days of not saying V’sein Tal Umatar.

ס"ק ל"ז ביה"ל ד"ה עד ביאורים ומוספים דרשו 43

Can one be certain that he said the right nusach even before thirty days have passed?

If a person mistakenly says the wrong verse one day during the thirty-day period, the poskim discuss whether that day counts and, if it does not count, whether he must restart the entire thirty-day count. Later poskim rule that it does not count, but it also does not invalidate the days that he already counted; he may continue counting until he reaches thirty days. If a person feels confident that he is fluent in the correct nusach before thirty days have passed, the poskim disagree on whether it can be assumed that he said the right verse even before the end of thirty days. This question can be approached in another way: If a person does not feel confident that he is fluent after thirty days, must it still be assumed that he did not say the right verse if he is in doubt? Some poskim say that one must be lenient on both questions and not repeat Shemoneh Esrei unless he stipulates (when it is permissible to do so) that if he is not obligated, his tefilla should be a tefillas nedavah.

ביאורים ומוספים דרשו 39

• A person who lives in a village without a minyan should wait until the end of the morning (before chatzos) to say Musaf with Mashiv Haruach. At that point, he can assume that the tzibur has already said Mashiv Haruach.

• A follower of the minhag Ashkenaz who is davening by himself on the first day of Pesach should daven Musaf as early as possible (i.e. before the chazan stops saying Mashiv Haruach) and say Mashiv Haruach. In contrast, a person who keeps minhag Sefard should daven Musaf later than the tzibur so he can say Morid Hatal after the chazan has already said it.



• Geshem in the wrong season is not beneficial for the world. Therefore, mentioning it at the wrong time can affect the validity of one’s Shemoneh Esrei. 

• At what point can it be assumed that a person davened correctly?

• Do the first two days of Pesach count as part of the thirty days of not saying V’Sein Tal Umatar?

• Can one be certain that he said the right nusach even before thirty days have passed?