Partner Profile: Marcius Extavour | |
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"On the one hand, we should have done a lot of things 10 years ago. On the other hand, we know what to do now and we know how to do it. Let's just do it. That idea, for me, is a big, big source of optimism."
This issue of the GCI newsletter features Marcius Extavour, Vice President, Energy & Climate at XPRIZE. Marcius is a thought leader and innovator working at the intersection of science, technology, global impact, and public policy in climate and energy. As a member of leadership group at XPRIZE Foundation, he oversees XPRIZE’s work in Energy & Climate, including the recent NRG COSIA Carbon XPRIZE and the new $100M XPRIZE Carbon Removal supported by the Musk Foundation.
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How did you transition from being a physics PhD exploring quantum mechanics to being a vocal climate change champion?
I always loved engineering, math and building things. My experiences led me into quantum physics, working in a lab, building things, but also trying to study pretty esoteric topics that I just thought were cool and interesting. I became more interested in climate as a graduate student, because I was more exposed to climate change science conversations. Over time, I went deeper and deeper in this direction, learning more and more and, eventually, I got a job in the energy industry.
I've been privileged to work on stuff that I think is cool, so I want to talk about it. I don’t expect that everyone I talk to will love this topic like I do, but maybe I can help someone see things in a new way, or I can help someone better grasp some of these concepts, which I know can be really tough to understand. I’ve worked hard on this material. I hope that, by talking to people and explaining things, my hard work can make it a little easier for others.
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In your AirMiners keynote speech, you bring up bridging communication gaps. How do you resolve communication issues with people of different backgrounds?
Communicating with different people can be a really tough challenge—but, at the same time, also a fun and rewarding challenge, if you can get it right. There are a couple of practical things you can do.
First, be self-reflective. Remember that even if others do not share your level of background knowledge, it doesn't mean that they're not smart, curious or capable. That might sound like a small thing, but it's actually a really big deal. There are many different types of intelligence; people are smart in different ways. You need to recognize that you're probably dealing with other really capable people and be careful not to be condescending when you're trying to share information. Challenge yourself to break it down in as clear, straightforward and plain language terms as possible.
And that's another point—find a common language. It doesn't dumb down the subject to explain it in plain language. You can still explain a very sophisticated and deep concept without using the usual jargon.
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Also, be mindful that many knowledge systems are hierarchical. You have to know concept “A,” before you can understand concept “B,” and you have to understand concept “B” before you can understand concept “C,” etc. If you want to have a conversation about something that's very complex, like climate change, you might have to know concepts A, B, and C already to really understand it. But it's not very helpful to meet somebody and say, “let's come in at level D,” if that person doesn’t understand levels A, B & C. You can’t expect someone to understand D if they do not understand A, B, & C first. However, this doesn’t mean you need to ask someone to take first year courses in topics A, B, & C before you can talk about D. Maybe you can summarize A, B, & C in a few sentences and then explain D.
Another thing to recognize is that, even though we all say we want to cross collaborate, it can be hard to meet and engage people who are from very different backgrounds than you. Sometimes, you have to force yourself to branch out a little—whether that means joining an online community that might be a little bit out of your depth, going to conferences, or whatever. Push yourself a little bit, even though it might feel a little overwhelming initially. That's okay. Take small steps. Just go to one session of a conference instead of the whole session. Slowly build up your network that way, but remember to be respectful and look for places of common language.
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One thing that I've learned the hard way is that if you're genuinely open to collaboration, or to sharing information, then it usually goes a long way. And, if you are not, then people smell that out right away. If you say that you’re here for collaboration, but really you want to educate the rest of the room about your position, it turns out that's a massive turnoff. No one wants to talk to you. But if you actually want to share, then you'll probably get something out of collaboration.
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Previously, you have talked about how carbon capture utilization was a fringe thing, even five years ago, but it's more common now. What do you see as being fringe now that will be more widely accepted in the next five years?
Despite the groundswell of attention and interest that it has been receiving, carbon removal is actually still a bit of a fringe topic because it is still being questioned and challenged. The new IPCC report that just came out states that carbon removal is a “need to have” not a “nice to have,” but I think some people are still asking questions about it. “What is it? How do we do it?”
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Also, I have a hunch that ecosystem restoration projects are going to be seen as more mainstream in the future. I'm talking about explicit ecosystem restoration, everything from afeforestation to rewilding to redevelopment of ocean fisheries, re-freezing glaciers and the polar ice cap, maybe efforts to push back desertificatio—in other words, direct, active interventions to try to unwind some of the effects of climate change. I think these types of projects will become more mainstream in a way they aren't today.
My view is that the traditional environmental movement has a big problem with those kinds of interventions. The concern is that, if we focus on those topics, it will be a free license to continue business as usual. It's a free pass. I don't really agree with that argument, but I understand the critique. I think that the reality of changing climate is going to soften that critique over time, in the same way that the critiques against CCUS have been softened in the face of the realization that we're not acting fast enough. Reducing emissions is still job one, but we clearly need more than reductions alone at this point.
| In your September 2020 Greenbiz talk, about unlocking a circular economy, you mentioned that societal issues like COVID and the fight for racial justice make it hard to focus on climate change. The recent IPCC report (AR6), which has some dire findings, is another development that could lead one to despair and lose focus. How do you stay focused and motivated? | |
Yeah, that's a great question. I started working on climate and energy because I thought it was interesting and cool. Maybe because I was really into science fiction as a kid, and still am really. I like thinking about Earth level energy systems and global ideas. At an intellectual level, I like a challenge—like the problem of dealing with runaway climate change, which can seem like an existential crisis.
But, I also realize that we don't have the luxury of just thinking about climate change on an intellectual level; it's real, even for people that are privileged and live in wealthy countries like me.
I just have a firm, unshakable belief that it is a solvable problem. When I say it’s “solvable,” that’s not the same thing as saying it’s “easy” or that we're not going to hit 1.5 degrees or greater. What I'm saying is, despite all of that, we as human beings have the power to solve this problem. And, I think some of the social dimensions are going to be just as challenging as the technological dimensions, though they are different, more political and collective action problems. The problem is a doozy. But, I am still optimistic about it.
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There will be a growing chorus of negativity, as more people digest the reality of where our climate situation is and the lack of action to date.
IPCC AR6 is not fundamentally bringing forward new information; it is clarifying information that we already knew, sharpening our insights, putting more certainty around some of our conclusions.
And, as the report is getting more media coverage, more and more people are tuning into this idea for the first time. It can be overwhelming and all the negativity might push some people into a sort of paralysis. Part of our job as climate scientists and climate professionals is to help people look forward to what we can do now, rather than backwards at what we should have done in the past.
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People are looking for leadership, which can take many forms. For those of us working in the climate space, just talking about what we do and why we're interested in it is a form of community building and leadership. And, it gives people some hope that this is doable.
The flip side of “why haven't we done more so far” is, “there's so many things we can do now.” There are so many things we know how to do now, which is actually very motivating. On the one hand, we should have done a lot of things 10 years ago. On the other hand, we know what to do now and we know how to do it. Let's just do it. That idea, for me, is a big, big source of optimism.
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What's in the pipeline for XPRIZE? What can we look forward to seeing next year?
I'll start with XPRIZE carbon removal, because that has already been launched. We're actively recruiting teams and competitors who want to enter. What that means is we're hosting information webinars, we're putting out videos, we are helping people figure out how to navigate the signup form.
There's a student section of the competition which will provide $5 million. We're just looking for proposals—you don't have to have a working device, you don't even have to have data. If you have data, that's better. But, if you don't have it, that's okay.
Student-based teams can be undergrads, graduate students, postdocs, or anyone under 35. If you're under 18, you have to get an adult, over 18, to sign with you. By the way, student-led means you can have a faculty advisor, you can have a business partner, you can have people that aren't students; we just want the majority of each team to be students. The deadline for students is October 1, 2021.
Also, we're going to give out fifteen $1 million checks to fifteen different projects next spring. The registration deadline for that process is December 1, 2021. The submission deadline is February 1, 2022. We'll be distributing the rest of the prize money later, once a team has a working demonstration that's fully up-and-running with verified data, etc.
We are also starting to build up our partnership network of people who can help competitors in the prize. Whether it's access to partnerships, or accelerator programs like Air Miners’ Launchpad for instance, we have a few more we're working on. So, stay tuned. All of this information is on our website.
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We also have a couple other prizes in the hopper. We have an active prize now called XPRIZE Rainforest. This prize is about mapping active rain forest ecosystems, using various sorts of data and sensing tools to try to promote conservation.
We are exploring a prize related to alternative fuels and energy carriers—think hydrogen, ammonia, fuel cells and other areas beyond just electrical-oriented solutions. We’re in the design phase of that prize. We will soon start to look for a funding partner, so we can try to make it into a real prize. And, we have a couple of other ideas in the hopper, so you should stay tuned for future news, but that should give you a quick snapshot of what to expect.
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Forecasting CDR Supply Curves
August 18
Want to receive a postcard from the future of carbon removal? Join AirMiners to hear from the team who broke new ground by modeling future supply quantities and costs across multiple carbon removal methods! Jennifer Mills, Ryan Anderson, Jason Yosinski, Shashank Agrawal, and Jake Connolly will show their forecast of future carbon removal supply and costs, created as part of a Problem Pack this past spring. For more information, click here.
Carbon Removal in Canada: Developing a Dynamic Industry Ecosystem
August 26
Come hear from an esteemed panel of Canadian carbon removal leaders on the myriad of CDR activities and opportunities for growing the industry in the country. For more information, click here.
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$100M XPRIZE Carbon Removal Competition
Sponsored by the Musk Foundation, this four year global competition invites innovators and teams from anywhere on the planet to create and demonstrate solutions that can pull carbon dioxide directly from the atmosphere or oceans. To learn more, click here.
Deadlines:
Submission deadline for the $5M Student Awards is October 1, 2021
Registration deadline for the $15M Milestone Awards is December 1, 2021
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